Southend winding up petition

[Rimshot]

As a matter of fact Rob, no one party is in power and the material you lifted from social networking defies any kind of translation into a political credo. It's just a series of vaguely right wing assertions which would probably have Daily Mail readers nodding in agreement.
Apologies by the way for posting my opinion but I didn't feel qualified to post anyone else's.

[Robpthegills]

LOL i love the way you always throw the daily mail at me. A paper I have not read in over 10 years.

You are entitled to an opinion, its just the way you look down on others who hold theirs.

Anyway onwards and upwards. There is no debate or discussion, you just think your right and belittle those who don't. Good luck to you.

[Robpthegills]

oh and btw....the post that I took off of a social networking site.

I explained where it was from in part to qualify how serious it should be taken and said it was thought provoking.

Sorry, i didnt realise randomness was forbidden on here, or the fact others can quote a tv programme or other such information media,
but if it disagrees with what you think then no one else can.

[Garawa]

I think half the trouble here is that key issues in history will always be used as beating stick and those that have always voted a certain way will always continue to do so. I like to think I can judge parties on their merits, but really do not see an alternative to what we have given the very recent track record of the last government. They ALL have very serious faults, there isn't one that deserves to be in power so constantly trying to undermine what is happening causes the issues.

As for Rob's post, I thought it was interesting. Who cares if it is factually inaccurate, it made you think and that was merely what Rob implied when he posted it. Whether it would actually happen or not is neither here nor there, there is a decent amount of potential in it that I am certain it implies to large sectors of SOME societies if not the country as a whole.

[gillsfan1066]

And with that the discussion came to a close, Robb pulled up his pants, Garawa gave his butt one last kiss and everyone went home for tea.
I'm joking, I'm joking, I too think the rich should be thrashed within an inch of their stinking miserable lives, have all their money and chattels taken away , then we will see who pays the taxes to keep the unemployed, unemployable and just down rite lazy in hand outs, guess all those unemployed, unemployable and down rite lazy will have to pay the taxes to cover their weekly or monthly payments, this should be fun to see.

[Poshgill]

Well, back to trying to write the same post that I attempted earlier............

Rob, I spoke to a mate today that was in the mob at the time of the miners dispute. He confirmed most definitely that some Army lads were deployed as covert Police officers. Special forces mainly and used as Agent Provocateurs to stir up trouble. He knows some of them personally. And they were based at Hereford at the time! They never wore collar numbers unlike regular bobbies. What you have to remember, the miners strike was the first political strike that was taken on by the Govt. Yes, we all know that the Labour Govt of the 70s were cosy with the trade unions at the time as they were the major contributors to the Labour Party (much like the Tories were cosy with the CBI) but Labour generally refused to get involved in industrial disputes, preferring to leave it to the Management to sort (with the exception of Barbara Castle getting involved with the striking women at Ford's, but that was more about equal opportunities). Thatcher had 2 things on her agenda. Smash the miners, because the Tories blamed them for the 3 day working week which ultimately brought down the Heath regime (The fact that his economic policies were a disaster with inflation running at almost 20% is lost in the mists of time) and Trade Union reform. Scargill played right into her hands. As I said earlier. 2 very similar characters that was always going to lead to a clash as both were too arrogant to reach a compromise. The irony is, that the only reason the Thatcher Govt could tackle the miners was because the country had just started to be become economically sufficient as North Sea Oil was generating income. The fact that the Govt was financially secure for the first time since before the war was as a result of the previous (and much maligned) Labour Govt taking the radical step to Nationalise North Sea Oil. A decision taken by, of all people, Tony Benn.

As for your post from FB comparing Socialism with High School grades. Well, I am surprised at a man as intelligent as you bothering with such clap-trap. It is a typical American load of old bull to simplify something so that their tiny minds can understand the concept. (BTW, Rimshot never accused you of being a Daily Mail reader, he simply stated that it is the sort of trite rubbish that would have a Mail reader nodding in agreement!)

Grades are given on ability. Not effort or desire. In life, some people are more fortunate than others. Some people, despite working hard, just do not possess the ability that others may. Some work hard and get lucky breaks, some people, through no fault of their own never get the breaks in life and just get dealt a bum hand and some people just do not have the ability to raise themselves to another level. Now, I would say that you, Rimshot and myself have done quite well for ourselves in our chosen careers. A lot of that is hard work but there is also a degree of fortune along the way. It is our responsibility to help those less fortunate than us in Society. The best way we can do that is by paying a little more back into Society (via the tax system). We do this to help those that are not able to have the fortune we have. This is the basis of Socialism. To create a better society for all, not just the privileged few. This is what separates us from the animals and, as a Christian, I'm sure you would agree, is the fundamental principle of Christianity.

[Snackboyslim]

Good gracious gents...

Way too deep for me, I live a quiet sort of life and just get on with things as nothing is going to be right for every one, never will be..

Any chance of getting back to the Southend 'predicament' ??

on a football note only, I have to agree with garawa- tho Posh, without wanting to get entangled in such a heavy debate.. great last paragraph my friend, couldn't agree with you more.

[gillsfan1066]

Some people are doctors, some are petrol station attendants, some are bus drivers ,some people are CEOs of multi national companies. Problem I see is that the guy who pumps the gas or drives the bus seems to have forgotten that he is not "entitled" to drive a Porsche, vacation in the Caribbean, or live in a 2 million pound house.
When my kids were born I looked all over for the stamp that said this baby will be a doctor or a nurse, a plumber or a hamburger flipper, and you know what nothing, nothing that said my kid would become an oral surgeon.
The person who "peaks" doing one of these lower paid jobs seems to resent the guy who is successful, e.g. his boss , resents the guy who goes to collage and studies 15 hours a day for 3 or more years, resents the guy who works his ass off to do well for himself and his family. Greatest saying in the world, the harder I work the luckier and more successful I become.
IT'S UNFAIR he's got a Porsche and I haven't, it's the teachers fault I screwed about a school, acted the fool, it's society's fault I spent every nite in the bar trying to pick up girls and getting drunk, it's not my fault I'm 50 and working at the local supermarket. YES IT *ing well IS, because it sure as hell is not mine or anyone else's.

[Rimshot]

Rob I'm sorry but you are the one getting shirty about others expressing an opinion. If I don't agree with you I'll say so and on this I don't. I respect that you are a sincere bloke and I've no wish to fall out with you but I think you are being way too sensitive.

I do agree with some of what 1066 says about a culture of envy; I think that's one area where the attitude in the USA is rather healthier than it is here. Fact is though that life can deal you some crap and when adversity is not your fault it must be hard to watch the Bob Diamonds of this world sitting on their ill-gotten gains, especially if you are a taxpayer still funding the left-overs of corporate greed. I know plenty of hard working people who are struggling at the moment and just as many well -heeled types who are the beneficiaries of undeserved advancement.

Life ain't fair. That doesn't mean you can't make it better.

[Poshgill]

Chicago, I do agree with you. We have created a culture of 'want it now' mentality and unfortunately that is a symptom of the 80s where greed is good was drummed into us. We (as a society) were brainwashed into believing that Left wing policies didn't work. Regan's Trickle-down economics (which was never going to work) and Thatcher's 'There is no such thing as Society' were, IMHO largely responsible for the state of the World today. We had a lot of young people growing up in the 80s who were real beneficiaries of these policies. They have then become the parents and leaders of another generation and have continued to practice the me, me, me society. This has now over-spilled into 'entertainment' where people with no discernible talent are famous just for being on TV. But we need to take stock. I suspect it is too late and I probably won't see any improvement in my lifetime as it will take at least another generation, but it is starting. People are starting to realise that Bankers are culpable for a lot of the problems. People are starting to realise that Politicians are a cheating bunch of liars (of all political persuasion) and a lot of hard working, decent honest people are fed up with sections of society either not contributing or getting far to much for not doing much.

Until politics gets back on track, we will continue to suffer. Liberalism has been shown that it doesn't work. We need strong leaders now and unfortunately, there are none of any party.